Page 1 of 4 123 ... Last
Results 1 to 10 of 37

Thread: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

  1. #1

    Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    This topic keeps coming up in other threads. Maybe it deserves its own thread.

    In one case, a customer had two identical and unopened items. The Crappy People said it would be "fraud" to return the older item using the receipt from the newer item.

    However, when asked to provide something to back up their theory, none of the Crappy People have been able to do so.

    Another case is when a customer has two identical items, where the older item was found to be defective. Again, the Crappy People has said it would be "fraud" to return the older defective item, using the receipt from the newer item.

    The Crappy People have written that "any deception is fraud" and that, "If I catch you even once trying to deceive, the police do come and the conviction rate is 100%".

    Again, the Crappy People have been unable to provide any evidence whatsoever of this claim, either.

    They've been asked to provide some proof from a reliable source that this falls under the legal definition of 'fraud' in Canada. They've had lots of definitions offered, but they all say the store has to suffer a loss (or "injury"), and the customer has to gain something they aren't entitled to. But this just isn't the case, if the customer is already entitled to a refund or exchange.

    They also haven't been able to show any web sites that describe this specific situation (i.e., using a new receipt to return an old item) and says its 'fraud'. Lots of other activities are listed as fraudulant - just not this one.

    Finally, the Crappy People have been asked to show some cases where people have been convicted of the crime of fraud for using a newer receipt to return an older item at Canadian Tire.

    They haven't provided a single one. Not at Canadian Tire, and not at any other store in Canada, either.

    What's surprising is how eager they are to convince customers to not attempt this type of return.

    They've used threats. They've called people names. They've said this is "theft" and "robbery".

    You'd think if they had some examples of laws and convictions available, they'd be trotting them out at every opportunity.

    Keep in mind, nobody is 'recommending fraud' or 'defending fraud'. We are just discussing what counts as fraud, which is a legitimate topic.

    I fully expect more threats, insults and false accusations on this subject.

    What would be useful is some actual evidence.

  2. #2

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    YOu may or may not be aware that simple cases of theft and fraud rarely if ever get published anywhere...news, newspapers etc...
    Well, here's a story about a case earlier this year.

    It involved an "intentionally smudged receipt".

    Fraud attempt lands pair in jail - The Whig Standard - Ontario, CA

    For sure, attempting a return of a second item with the same, tampered receipt is clearly a crime.

    (Plus, being on probation at the time probably didn't help in the sentencing.)

    Of course, I'd never 'defend' or 'recommend' an actual fraud, like the pair in Kingston tried.

    It's just that there's still no evidence at all, that it's a 'fraud' to return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later

    No reason to think the store would suffer an "injury" (they are on the hook for a return), so no 'fraud'.

    No reason to think the customer would get something they weren't entitled to (they were already entitled to a return), so no 'fraud'.

    Not included in the list of 'frauds' that have been provided.

    No cases of convictions for this type of return.

    You'd think if the "conviction rate is 100%", there'd at least be one news story, at some point.

    Gee, maybe that's because it's not fraud at all, if a customer returns something you actually bought, and is unopened, or defective?

  3. #3
    Posted by an unregistered user Angry CT Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    933
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    Well, here's a story about a case earlier this year.

    It involved an "intentionally smudged receipt".

    Fraud attempt lands pair in jail - The Whig Standard - Ontario, CA

    For sure, attempting a return of a second item with the same, tampered receipt is clearly a crime.

    (Plus, being on probation at the time probably didn't help in the sentencing.)

    Of course, I'd never 'defend' or 'recommend' an actual fraud, like the pair in Kingston tried.

    It's just that there's still no evidence at all, that it's a 'fraud' to return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later

    No reason to think the store would suffer an "injury" (they are on the hook for a return), so no 'fraud'.

    No reason to think the customer would get something they weren't entitled to (they were already entitled to a return), so no 'fraud'.

    Not included in the list of 'frauds' that have been provided.

    No cases of convictions for this type of return.

    You'd think if the "conviction rate is 100%", there'd at least be one news story, at some point.

    Gee, maybe that's because it's not fraud at all, if a customer returns something you actually bought, and is unopened, or defective?
    There's no back tracking on your previous acceptance of retail fraud and there is no way YOU'RE interpretation of anything is meaningful or relevant. You've been proven to be a faker advocate time and again and no one is fooled.
    Sorry faker, the world doesn't think like you and never will.

  4. #4

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    There's no back tracking on your previous acceptance of retail fraud
    Sorry - who accepted "retail fraud"?

    Did a consumer here accept that "retail fraud" includes 'return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later'?

    I just don't see that anywhere. Sorry!

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    You've been proven to be a faker advocate time and again
    Reallly? There's a definition somewhere of what a "faker advocate" is?

    Again, I just don't see that anywhere - sorry again!

    And, theres now some 'proof' that a specific unregistered poster meets the definition of "faker advocate"?

    Again, I just don't see that anywhere - sorry #3!

    So ....

    1 - Still no examples of anybody being convicted of "fraud" for using a receipt from a new item to return an old, unopened item. Not from your store (assuming you have one). None from any store at all!

    2 - Still no reputable sources (or any sources at all!) that say "any deception is fraud".

    3 - Still no evidence that, "If I catch you even once trying to deceive, the police do come and the conviction rate is 100%".

    4 - Still not even a single example of anybody being convicted for using a receipt from a new item to return an old, open and defective item that they recently purchased.

    And now we could add:

    5 - Still no evidnence that the consumers who post here have previously accepted the Crappy People's definition of "fraud".

    6 - Still no definition of "faker advocate", or proof that any consumer meet that definition.

    Do you think you might be able to provide ANY of that?

    Or are you still just full of crap?

    Still waiting ...

  5. #5

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    YOu may or may not be aware that simple cases of theft and fraud rarely if ever get published anywhere...news, newspapers etc...
    Interested about that altered receipt case from Kingston. A pretty "simple case", involving less than $100.

    Here's another one, in the last year. This one is employee fraud, at the returns desk:

    Canadian Tire defrauded by employee - Peterborough Examiner - Ontario, CA

    Over $6000 - seems to be employees are more ambitious, lol.

    But nothing in there about it being fraud to 'return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later'.

    Gee, where's the proof of all these cases the Crappy People have been spouting off about?

    Still waiting!

  6. #6
    Posted by an unregistered user CT Me / Lawguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    494
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    I can't even understand how you think that could be legal. YOu buy an item with a one year warranty. 6 months later buy another one, use that receipt to return the original purchase and now you have a new one. You could play this game all year long and extend a one year warranty forever. You don't see an issue with that?

    Years ago as a Service manager I had a guy who would pay for the lifetime of the tire warranty and buy a new set of 4. Just as they were down to the end of their tread life he'd come in and say they were defective, replace all 4.
    naturallY i sent him packing. Is he attempting fraud or do you faker consumer advocates believe this is okay?
    I'm sure there's something in the CPA or SGA that allows him to do that LOL oh wait, no there isn't.
    He's a theif!!!

  7. #7

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    I can't even understand how you think that could be legal. YOu buy an item with a one year warranty. 6 months later buy another one, use that receipt to return the original purchase and now you have a new one. You could play this game all year long and extend a one year warranty forever. You don't see an issue with that?
    I can't understand how The Crappy People think this is illegal (to return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later.)

    I can't understand why the Crappy People can't find a single web site that describes this.

    I can't understand why the Crappy People can't find a single case of anyone being convicted of fraud for doing this.

    Hey, here's an idea!

    Maybe, if the item is still under warranty, and the customer gets a working one, then the customer is just getting what they are entitled to: a working one!!

    Yeah! That sure fits!

    It sure is looking like it's not really fraud at all!

  8. #8
    Posted by an unregistered user CT Me / Lawguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    494
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    I can't understand how The Crappy People think this is illegal (to return an item you've purchased, using a receipt for an identical item that you've purchased later.)

    I can't understand why the Crappy People can't find a single web site that describes this.

    I can't understand why the Crappy People can't find a single case of anyone being convicted of fraud for doing this.

    Hey, here's an idea!

    Maybe, if the item is still under warranty, and the customer gets a working one, then the customer is just getting what they are entitled to: a working one!!

    Yeah! That sure fits!

    It sure is looking like it's not really fraud at all!
    If the customer had his original receipt in the first place, he'd get the product he is entitled to under warranty.
    If he loses his receipt he is not entitled to the warranty for the defective item.

    It is the customers responsibility to keep your documentation. period.

  9. #9

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    If the customer had his original receipt in the first place, he'd get the product he is entitled to under warranty.
    Of course, we all know there are several problems with that.

    There are many ways to prove that an item was purchased from Crappy Tire, and that it's still under the Crappy Tire warranty, but there are countless stories of customers who were still denied a legitimate refund or replacement.

    For instance, a life-time Crappy Tire warranty requires keeping a little slip of paper for decades. If it's a product that is made exclusively for Crappy Tire, then the store has no basis for denying a replacement, but the Crappy Stores will use a missing 10-year-old receipt as an excuse to deny a refund.

    Then there are the Crappy Tire stores that print receipts on crappy paper, so it deteriorates. Or on thermal paper that quickly fades. Then the poor customer is screwed, through the poor choices of the store.

    Of course, many other stores (Home Depot, for instance) actually keep track of what you bought, so you don't need to meticulously track every receipt, the way Crappy Tire does.

    Plus there are many ways to prove that the transaction took place, like bank statements and credit card statements. But stories abound of customers who were denied refunds, replacements or warranty repairs, even though they could prove that they purchased the item.

    None of these Crappy actions count as good customer service: just Crappy Service.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unregistered View Post
    If he loses his receipt he is not entitled to the warranty for the defective item.
    Really? You're sure about that? Despite being about to prove in other ways that they purchased the item on a particular day?

    No, the laws in this regard do NOT state that a receipt is required. This is something that the Crappy People made up.

    If a consumer can demonstrate that they purchased the item, and it's still under warranty, then the store still has the same legal obligations.

    Besides, there are many stories of consumers who had a valid receipt, yet Crappy Tire refuses a legitimate refund or exchange. Take the "repair only" items for instance.

  10. #10
    Posted by an unregistered user Angry CT Guy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    933
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Fraud to Return Identical Products With Different Receipts?

    Why have any policies at all? Why would any store do anything to protect themselves from the likes of you? Why don't stores let the customer interpret their own version of the truth, you know, based on their socio-economic upbringing?
    Yeah, like that will ever happen, LOL!
    And for the record, lifetime warranty doesn't mean you only have to buy one for the rest of your life...it's for manufacturers's defects. If you use it lots and over time it just wears out, that's not a defect, but wear and tear and no warranty covers normal wear and tear.....imbecile.

Page 1 of 4 123 ... Last

Similar Threads

  1. Products With "No Warranty" - No Refund, No Exchange, No Repair (As-Is)
    By DavidLeR in forum General Canadian Tire Complaints / Chat
    Replies: 55
    Last Post: September 10th, 2012, 10:01 PM
  2. Return policy
    By Bob in forum Personal Stories
    Replies: 164
    Last Post: June 14th, 2012, 09:38 PM
  3. Can't return anything
    By Guest-0376 in forum Canadian Tire 40 Hunterhorn Dr. N.E., Calgary, AB
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: December 7th, 2010, 10:00 AM
  4. Ask a question: TIRE CHAIN RETURN
    By CT_MANAGER in forum Employees Speak Out
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: December 1st, 2010, 12:13 PM
  5. Canadian Tire Return issue
    By Christopher in forum Personal Stories
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: January 6th, 2010, 07:48 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions