COMPLAINT ACTIVITY REPORT Case # 1284000 Better Business Bureau of Mid-Western and Central Ontario
2013-09-05 WEB BBB RECEIVE BUSINESS RESPONSE :
Contact Name and Title: Bernice Csaszar
Contact Phone: 905-829-5552 x313
Contact Email:
tford@ctc424.ca
In responce to this gentleman's complaint is as follow's. Customer informed that he needed thermostat and gasket and was also told he needed cooling fan relay which was optional. Then we had to recheck after repair completed. He asked me if he should do the relay I said that it was up to him with that he replied ok do it. Cost for repair $428.00 and change. Repair was completed and still had issue I called him and informed him there still was an overheat problem and he required waterpump as he still didn't have coolant flow. He said that he was coming over,when he arrived he brought a friend that started to argue and say that he shouldn't have brought it to a canadian. The tech explained why you have to start where he did and the friend wouldn't let him finish so I said we will deal with the owner of the car and the gentleman that wrote you this letter left and left his friend. The friend said he would be back to speak to the service manager who was off sick and I told him he wouldn't be back until thurs.Gave him my card and service managers card. The owner of the car came in on wed looking for service manager and was told he was off sick and suppose to be in on the thurs as I had told his friend.
The owner showed up thurs at 9:15 am and apoligized for his rude friend and he didn't want to fight anymore. I tried explaining to him again and he wanted to talk again to the mechanic again he wouldn't let him say what he needed to say asked to speak to another mechanic which he did and again wouldn't let him speak. Went over to his car and climbed on the trunk and said call the police I'm not leaving. The General Manager and Store Manager came to service and tried to reason with him and he got hostile with the store manager. He was very aggressive with me and the teck stepped between myself and the customer as he thought I was in harms way. After 2hrs of this we called the police they came made him take his personal effects out of the car and escorted him out and he was issued a no trespass to the store along with his two friends he called for backup. He was given two options by myself and the police officer. Leave the ownership signed or pay his bill.Any further question or concerns let us know.
Sincerely,
Bernice Assistant Service Manager.
2013-09-06 ASH EMAIL Forward Business response to Consumer
2013-09-10 WEB BBB RECEIVED CONSUMER REBUTTAL : (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
I would go step by step of CT response to explain with all along with proof (which I can provide) ("Canadian Tire response" would be in the quotation mark.)
1- CT Responded => "CUSTOMER INFORMED THAT HE NEEDED THERMOSTAT AND GASKET AND WAS ALSO TOLD HE NEEDED COOLING FAN RELAY WHICH WAS OPTIONAL. THEN WE HAD TO RECHECK AFTER REPAIR COMPLETED. HE ASKED ME IF HE SHOULD DO THE RELAY I SAID THAT IT WAS UP TO HIM WITH THAT HE REPLIED OK DO IT. COST FOR REPAIR $428.00 AND CHANGE"
Response => The car was towed to Canadian Tire because of the Overheated so I came over to front desk asking if I want it to get the car to be fixed, told them I don't want to spend more than $500 on the car since it is just a old car and doesn't worth to spend too much on it so I needed to know the estimate before anything have been done. And she mention that kind of problem should not cost more.
Proof: as far as I know: for whatever customer wants to be done, CT is asking for the worksheet to get signed by the customer, it is also included cost of the repair. For example last time I brought the same car asking for the oil change plus inspection for the break system. CT called telling that there is no issue with the break but rear suspension and some other places need to get fixed cost $1800+tax which I said no thanks since this car is old so if I want to fix every thing on the car, would better to go and buy a new car so, I have the detail of CT reports papers (Inv 20042400024089). That is what I mean and expect from CT by inspection.
I totally understand that you guys are very busy so you may not remember every single customer that is why I would like you, to please get back to the worksheet which has been signed by me including the charge of $48.5 & check it one more time; double check what I asked for, it was just "Heating & Cooling inspection". Why? In order to gets the estimate for the cost of the repair of the overheated. Also I clearly mentioned that I am not wondering to spend more than $500 on this car. Please let me know if there is anything else on that paper.
Also it does not make sense to me to tow the car & asking to change the thermostat. Why? Two reasons:
1-Thermostat for this car alone is just $15.75+Tax and I would have done it myself not need to towed the car 25 km from my home!
2-If I knew the issue for overheated is the Thermostat why should I've paid for the Inspection then?
3-CT Responded => "Repair was completed and still had issue I called him and informed him there still was an overheat problem and he required waterpump as he still didn't have coolant flow. He said that he was coming over"
Response => I am totally agree on this part cause "Repair is completed" means to me that overheated problem is getting fixed and there is no more issue; but kind of confusion about the water pump problem! CT supposed to found it out on the Inspection and let me know before they have done any kind of repair
I also expected this call, since she told me that they are going to let me know when the car is ready to go.
CT Responded => "WHEN HE ARRIVED HE BROUGHT A FRIEND THAT STARTED TO ARGUE AND SAY THAT HE SHOULDN'T HAVE BROUGHT IT TO A CANADIAN. THE TECH EXPLAINED WHY YOU HAVE TO START WHERE HE DID AND THE FRIEND WOULDN'T LET HIM FINISH SO I SAID WE WILL DEAL WITH THE OWNER OF THE CAR AND THE GENTLEMAN THAT WROTE YOU THIS LETTER LEFT AND LEFT HIS FRIEND. THE FRIEND SAID HE WOULD BE BACK TO SPEAK TO THE SERVICE MANAGER WHO WAS OFF SICK AND I TOLD HIM HE WOULDN'T BE BACK UNTIL THURS.GAVE HIM MY CARD AND SERVICE MANAGERS CARD. THE OWNER OF THE CAR CAME IN ON WED LOOKING FOR SERVICE MANAGER AND WAS TOLD HE WAS OFF SICK AND SUPPOSE TO BE IN ON THE THURS AS I HAD TOLD HIS FRIEND"
Response => I am mechanical engineer (even when I said that on CT they laughed at me however, it is not an issue right now), also HVAC licensed technician however not very good at English so I asked my friend who used to work as a product manager on vehicle production to come with me. Because he is also professional on engine department to please help me on my English and technical issues on CT. we totally listen to the CT's mechanic who was (at first) kind of embarrassed for the mistake & miss diagnosed on overheated issue. So I came up with the simple question, "why should I pay for your mistake since the issue is same as before?" She told me that, they can talk to one at the time and one of you guys has to leave the place which I did, to respect her, and leave the place but my friend tried to explain that since there is no flow of water and the radiator & heater are not even warm so you should have known that kind of water pump problem and let us know before, they also told me that I should have asked my friend to fixed the car and not to CT, which is not nice!!
However they told me that we have two options either to pay $428+Tax or discus with the manager (Tony). And I need to come over the day after on Wednesday Aug-21 which I've been there whole day & Tony did not showed up, I would not waste my time if I knew he is not coming. I've never seen him even after that date. She "CT writer" was off on the day maybe that is why she didn't mention it, anyway I talk to another customer service he was totally understand and asked me to come on Thursday Aug-22, even though I had to take the bus but I left the place and had no issue on that day.
CT Responded => "THE OWNER SHOWED UP THURS AT 9:15 AM AND APOLIGIZED FOR HIS RUDE FRIEND AND HE DIDN'T WANT TO FIGHT ANYMORE. I TRIED EXPLAINING TO HIM AGAIN AND HE WANTED TO TALK AGAIN TO THE MECHANIC AGAIN HE WOULDN'T LET HIM SAY WHAT HE NEEDED TO SAY ASKED TO SPEAK TO ANOTHER MECHANIC WHICH HE DID AND AGAIN WOULDN'T LET HIM SPEAK."
Response => there two things that doesn't make sense here
a-If I was nice apologized for my friend and you let me in the shop talk to the mechanic (which is true) why I shouldn't have to listen to the mechanic?
b-If I didn't listen to the first mechanic doesn't make sense you let me talk to the other mechanic.
I am not saying that you are a liar; just you may not aware of our conversation. I listen to what he said and I can tell you what he told me and what my response was.
Summary of our conversation was "they tried to explain that this is a procedure which they are going to change every parts could make overheated between, until the issue gets fixed" it makes sense if I had asked you guys to fix the car and cost was not the issue. However I told you at very first day that I don't want to spend more than $500 to fix the problem that is why I paid extra for inspection. I mention that to you and the other mechanic that I already searched on internet and talk to more than five mechanics and they all noticed that you guys have to realize the water pump problem before they change the relay on fan which was working properly on low speed that could be the last item in your list. I am not blame on you since you are not a technician or mechanic, you do the customer service. I asked mechanic "what happened if you guys change the water pump and then you come up with engine problem?" he did not have answer! If there is anything else between us please let me know.
Here is some other questions which I asked never get answer by mechanic or customer service
A.If you didn't make mistake on Inspection why should you charge 89.99+Tax to exchange Cooling System since you need to do that again after changing water pump again? And why you try to charge the customer for kind of big mistake?
B.Why you hidden some letters on item 0209722 which mentioned R4751 Relay?
C. Why are you charging for Cooling & Heating System Inspection (Item CHINS)
I am really logical, the second day you where off on the day I asked CT customer Service to give me a letter shows that CT Mechanics can not find the water pump problem unless they change the relay on the Fan and I am ready to pay the full amount but he asked to come and see Tony. So want you to please be honestly response for what was happening.
CT Responded => "WENT OVER TO HIS CAR AND CLIMBED ON THE TRUNK AND SAID CALL THE POLICE I'M NOT LEAVING. THE GENERAL MANAGER AND STORE MANAGER CAME TO SERVICE AND TRIED TO REASON WITH HIM AND HE GOT HOSTILE WITH THE STORE MANAGER. HE WAS VERY AGGRESSIVE WITH ME AND THE TECK STEPPED BETWEEN MYSELF AND THE CUSTOMER AS HE THOUGHT I WAS IN HARMS WAY. AFTER 2HRS OF THIS WE CALLED THE POLICE THEY CAME MADE HIM TAKE HIS PERSONAL EFFECTS OUT OF THE CAR AND ESCORTED HIM OUT AND HE WAS ISSUED A NO TRESPASS TO THE STORE ALONG WITH HIS TWO FRIENDS HE CALLED FOR BACKUP. HE WAS GIVEN TWO OPTIONS BY MYSELF AND THE POLICE OFFICER. LEAVE THE OWNERSHIP SIGNED OR PAY HIS BILL.ANY FURTHER QUESTION OR CONCERNS LET US KNOW."
Response => honestly next time if someone climbed on the trunk and asked you to call the police with no reason you need to call the mental hospital not the police. You should have mentioned to the big guy with the tattoo who told me nicely "Get F* out of here right now". Who was that person? Was he the manager or the mechanic or just the CT customer service? When he threatened me whit that language what did I say? Have I been rude? That was the real time I went to my car asking for the manager Tony. Someone told me if I don't leave the place we will call the police. Just be honest please. I did not believe that you guys are going to do that, and yes I said ok do it. I was expected to see someone responsible after three days go and back to CT. I had my other mechanic to fix the water pump & Time Belt asking $400 not $1300, It would have been done on a day after (on Friday) if you guys released my car on Thursday. I could have my car running by that weekend.
If the manager was the person who laughed at me when I said I am mechanical engineer used to work as a designer back my home country and she asked me how much do I earn here when I said $12/hour that makes her laugh again and asking why should I driving this old car then, I don't remember which part was I rude. As far as I remember they speak all together and didn't mention what I am saying yelling asking me to leave the place. The time I was aware you guys are going to call the police I called my friends to come over and try to negotiate since you don't listen to me so it may affect you guys not to call the police and solve the issue there, but shortly after police shows up before my friend's coming. My friends didn't get the chance to talk just back to the car and waiting to pick me up to home.
Please mention that I offer you guys to take the parts you installed off and refund it then charge me for the labor. Which makes sense I can refund the item at lest for first few days. Even police was saying that could be a good offer but you guys did not accept that either. If I get the police report they should have mentioned that offer. Even police a guy who asked me to go home and gave me the small court address was suppressed by CT customer service. He was so nice wants me to back to the place asking me to make sure if I don't have any valuables left in the car.
I don't understand why you asked the customer to sign the ownership and leave the car in CT? Is there anything behind the story I need to know?
I have never had any issue whit you (the CT writer) just tell me which part of our conversation I was rude then I would be apologize for that.
The part you mention someone came between us to protect you, Just for your information that I had an accident three years ago (fall down from the ladder when I was working) which I have big problem on my spine (disc) two times on Sunnybrook wants to do the emergency surgery but I refused for my personal reason and I suffering of pain and numbness under (ODSP) disability program support so just tell me how could I harm someone with that situation? This is the first time ever I have involved with the police issue and hope would be the last time. my car is still there wondering How could you come up with this response after long time?