"Repair Only Warranty" - No Refund, No Exchange

Unregistered said:

You mean Ellen Roseman, the professional consumer advocate agrees with us?

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Ellen agreed with us consumers on a couple of other points.

Despite what various Crappy People have said, "Don't count on a refund from Canadian Tire on merchandise that doesn't meet your needs". Amen!

Of course, it's a good idea with any retailer to "Hang on to your sales receipts and original packaging. Don't throw them out or misplace them."

And there's also this piece of advice what we've been repeating for a while: "Shop elsewhere if you're not sure the product you buy will be satisfactory."

Or if the product might potentially be defective.

So, really just "Shop elsewhere!".

Pay close attention to here wording

INSIST on a refund if it's defective. She then states what the law says. Must sell products that are saleable and fit for intended purpose.

Both of which are 100% correct.

It does not say that the law requires a refund.
Sorry, caught on a technicality, which really is how laws are written. All detailed wording

you lose

Unregistered said:

Pay close attention to here wording

INSIST on a refund if it's defective. She then states what the law says. Must sell products that are saleable and fit for intended purpose.

Both of which are 100% correct.

It does not say that the law requires a refund.
Sorry, caught on a technicality, which really is how laws are written. All detailed wording

you lose

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Oh, please, spare us.

By 'pay close attention', you mean, 'lets take everything out of context, so that there's no meaning'.

Nice trick, but it won't work.

"Finally, insist on a refund if the product is defective on unsafe. Under the law, stores have an obligation to sell merchandise that is saleable and suits the intended purpose -- no matter what their return policies may say."

And what does the policy say? It says, "No refund".

Indeed, if there wasn't a law requiring a refund, then a customer couldn't "insist on" getting one.

Even if Ellen hadn't written it again on the 6th, there's a thread with a list of about 16 experts who all say the same thing: "refund".

https://www.canadiantiresucks.net/g...ints-chat/707-sale-goods-act-10.html#post4599

Consumers who are interested in learning more should consider doing a bit of research, because the Crappy People most certainly do NOT have our best intersests in mind.

We now return you to the background noise of "donate, 600 sucks, drunken ranting, call Ellen".

(Oh, wait: forget that last one!)

theres really just so much to like in this

How to get a refund from Canadian Tire - moneyville.ca Blogs

it tells the truth about crappy tires crappy policies to a wide audience

it gives some actual examples of ordinary people being ripped off by crappy tire

it reiterates that refunds are required by law for defective products - ie illegal to refuse

but heres what i like most of all

in just a couple of days over 60 (ex)customers wrote in with complaints of their own

9 pages of complaints and growing

i thing thats some kind of moneyville record

yes - this story really does resonate with consumers

Unregistered said:

Pay close attention to here wording

INSIST on a refund if it's defective. She then states what the law says. Must sell products that are saleable and fit for intended purpose.

Both of which are 100% correct.

It does not say that the law requires a refund.
Sorry, caught on a technicality, which really is how laws are written. All detailed wording

you lose

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Hey it's the pHD in consumer law, returns desk guy and mega mega expert in midget toilet paper stamped with SIN numbers.

So your expert interpretation of what Ellen is saying isn't what she's saying, right? Ok. Gotcha. And what about the last sentence of "Under the law, stores have an obligation to sell merchandise that is saleable and suits the intended purpose -- no matter what their return policies may say". Ignore it! Ok. Gotcha.

Unregistered said:

theres really just so much to like in this

How to get a refund from Canadian Tire - moneyville.ca Blogs

it tells the truth about crappy tires crappy policies to a wide audience

it gives some actual examples of ordinary people being ripped off by crappy tire

it reiterates that refunds are required by law for defective products - ie illegal to refuse

but heres what i like most of all

in just a couple of days over 60 (ex)customers wrote in with complaints of their own

9 pages of complaints and growing

i thing thats some kind of moneyville record

yes - this story really does resonate with consumers

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For sure

Also explains the other 600 sucks.com sites

People like to bitch, kinda like why bad news sells way more than good news....ever wonder why?

No donate button at Moneyville though, they make enough on the sale of their media.

I see Ellen stopped short of calling CTC's policies as illegal...you should call her and ask about that omission.

And absolutely....Canadian Tire is not a good try me out and see if you like it store. I can only imagine how many vacuums you would need until you found one you like.....LOL

I even take returns without a receipt, but after this article, maybe I don't need to.....

Unregistered said:

Literally ROFLMFAO!

I had to climb back into my chair to write this post!

Holy Crap!!!!!

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Yeah, now DavidLer can come out of his self-imposed exile and be the man he once thought he was....oh yeah, except that small bit about supporting fraud....yeah, that might be a wee problem.

Unregistered said:

Hey it's the pHD in consumer law, returns desk guy and mega mega expert in midget toilet paper stamped with SIN numbers.

So your expert interpretation of what Ellen is saying isn't what she's saying, right? Ok. Gotcha. And what about the last sentence of "Under the law, stores have an obligation to sell merchandise that is saleable and suits the intended purpose -- no matter what their return policies may say". Ignore it! Ok. Gotcha.

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Yikes, another booze fest and it's only Thursday!

well, i'll admit it

my faith in the Canadian Tire Legal Team was once rock-solid

i thought they were very versed in all legal aspect of the stores

from privacy legislation to consumer protection acts

after all, store owners depend on them to know the laws inside and out, and ensure that the stores are safe from legal blunders

then it's revealed that the ct lawyers got their butts kicked over the privacy issues were asked to fix their entire computer system

the shocking news was revealed in thread https://www.canadiantiresucks.net/g...t/777-collecting-id-personal-information.html

if they are wrong about privacy legislation, i guess they are wrong about refunds, too, and consumers really CAN get refunds for defective items

just like the 16 or so experts have been saying - the ones who are quoted on this site.

yeah, those 'crack' lawyers aren't all they're cracked up to be

Unregistered said:

except that small bit about supporting fraud....yeah, that might be a wee problem.

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Have you forgotten already?

The so-called 'fraud', was nothing more than consumers returning things unopened during the 90 day exchange period, then re-buying when it was on sale.

Pretty smart, actually!

Oh, and there was the case of a customer who bought a second item on sale, then drove all the way home, got the original unopened item, and returned it for a refund.

The Crappy People even admitted that it was all about losing money on sale prices, not about any so-called 'fraud'.

Oh, and where's that list of convictions for people who buy a second item, but use the receipt from the first, identical item?

Still waiting, since you brought it up. Any cases to back that up? Any at all?

No, it was just a bunch of whining from Crappy People who think anything they don't like must be 'fraud', LOL!

Unregistered said:

Have you forgotten already?

The so-called 'fraud', was nothing more than consumers returning things unopened during the 90 day exchange period, then re-buying when it was on sale.

Pretty smart, actually!

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ill have to remember that the next time something i haven't opened goes on sale.

was that advice from the same davidler who started this thread? it's #3 on the 'most viewed threads' list.

no wonder all the crappies are out to get him, lol!

Unregistered said:

Have you forgotten already?

The so-called 'fraud', was nothing more than consumers returning things unopened during the 90 day exchange period, then re-buying when it was on sale.

Pretty smart, actually!

Oh, and there was the case of a customer who bought a second item on sale, then drove all the way home, got the original unopened item, and returned it for a refund.

The Crappy People even admitted that it was all about losing money on sale prices, not about any so-called 'fraud'.

Oh, and where's that list of convictions for people who buy a second item, but use the receipt from the first, identical item?

Still waiting, since you brought it up. Any cases to back that up? Any at all?

No, it was just a bunch of whining from Crappy People who think anything they don't like must be 'fraud', LOL!

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Bought PS3 console bundle … girl said she doesnt know of any policy that rules out physical damage issues but I need the origional box’

It sounds like a judgment call by the clerk, and there could be lots of wiggle-room to say you broke it yourself, so you may have lucked out by getting this offer. I’m not sure what the warranty terms are, but if all you need to do is come in with the box, and they’ll give you a replacement, I’d jump on that ASAP.

If you run into more trouble, a key issue is whether or not the item was defective, and whether you damaged it. If the item was defective, the CPA laws in Ontario say that you are entitled to an exchange or a refund – you don’t need to bother with the manufacture’s warranty, or any extended warranty (unless you want to).

The controller is intended to be operated by holding it in your hand, and it has fallen apart after you, well, held it in your hand. It should be able to withstand that use (but maybe not being slammed into a coffee table - is it clear that nothing like that happened?)

This also might be a common defect with these units - that would help your case.

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Buy a new controller, and put the old controller in the packaging of the new controller and return it (at a different store).

This could back-fire, because FS may refuses to provide a refund on the first unit - they'd be stuck with two of them, and still have a bad controller.

You are proposing getting the refund from a different store, but this is not the store that sold the defective item, so it's not fair to that store owner.

Also, you should be warned that I proposed a similar solution over in the I bought a defective item during boxing week and lost the receipt - RedFlagDeals.com Forums thread, and a user there accused me of being a criminal, for several days straight. In my case, there was only the original retailer, and still I was told this was a “crime of fraudulent misrepresentation”.

However, no convincing evidence was presented to support that claim.

(I think some of the out-cry was due to the potential misuse of this approach to actually defraud someone.)

The consensus was that the switch-around should only be used with the original seller, and only as a last resort, after doing one's best to comply with reasonable requests from the retailer (such as providing packaging and the receipt), because the switch-around would be a deliberate deception of a retailer. A basically harmless one, but still a deception.


That's DavidLer's post on Redflags. Nothing about a sale item and he self admits the deception. That's why he posts on here under anonymous now.....the lack of credibility is pretty staggering.

Unregistered said:

Yeah, now DavidLer can come out of his self-imposed exile and be the man he once thought he was....oh yeah, except that small bit about supporting fraud....yeah, that might be a wee problem.

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Oh how the Crappy people think the world is against them. Everybody's a thief in Crappys eyes so they violate everyone's privacy with swiping drivers license info for returns to prevent fraud at crappys coast to coast. And the fraud they're talking about? It's nothing more than returning items at the regular price and repurchasing them on sale. Said before, worth saying again. A good practice long encouraged by Retailers in north america to build customer loyalty. Some good retailers recognizing the inconvenience to the customers of bringing back the items encourage bringing back JUST the receipt and refunding the difference!!! Lowest price guarantee is what it's called! Crappys calls it what? FRAUD. Where are the lawsuits, police sting operations on the customers, where are the convictions. The jails must be busting at the seems with moms and dads with all that FRAUD!!! What? There's none? No proof? Then Crappys should have a big frothy mug of STFU.

Crappys, however will violate their own 90 day return policy, and NOT give refunds back to the customer, contravening consumer law. And the main reason for Ellen's consumer article How to get a refund from Canadian Tire - moneyville.ca Blogs

Crappy sucks that bad!

Unregistered said:

That's DavidLer's post on Redflags. Nothing about a sale item and he self admits the deception.

Click to expand...

I know the Crappy People don't like it, but deception isn't fraud.

And returning things in accordance with store policy isn't fraud either, even if the Crappy People don't like losing money this way.

No, there has to be a deception, a financial loss to the store, and an undeserved financial gain to the customers.

In the case where the customer was entitled to a refund or exchange, and they get, there's no loss to the store, or unwarranted gain to the customer, so no fraud. Period, end of story. The Crappy People don't like it, but that's just too bad.

Ditto for the case where a customer abided by the 90 day policy when they returned something for that is unopened, but had gone on sale. No deception in this case, and all in accordance with store policies. The Crappy People even admitted that it was all about the store losing out on some money. Just because they lost don't like their own policies, that doesn't make it fraud.

But, we've been over this stuff already.

The Crappy People just can't seem to get their heads around.

Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it the crime of 'fraud'.

Sorry, Crappy People!

Unregistered said:

I know the Crappy People don't like it, but deception isn't fraud.

And returning things in accordance with store policy isn't fraud either, even if the Crappy People don't like losing money this way.

No, there has to be a deception, a financial loss to the store, and an undeserved financial gain to the customers.

In the case where the customer was entitled to a refund or exchange, and they get, there's no loss to the store, or unwarranted gain to the customer, so no fraud. Period, end of story. The Crappy People don't like it, but that's just too bad.

Ditto for the case where a customer abided by the 90 day policy when they returned something for that is unopened, but had gone on sale. No deception in this case, and all in accordance with store policies. The Crappy People even admitted that it was all about the store losing out on some money. Just because they lost don't like their own policies, that doesn't make it fraud.

But, we've been over this stuff already.

The Crappy People just can't seem to get their heads around.

Just because you don't like it, doesn't make it the crime of 'fraud'.

Sorry, Crappy People!

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Deception isn't fraud? What is it then?
Here, this will help you:
Fraud - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Maybe faker advocate thinks he's a crafty consumer, but really, he just supports fraud. And it's losers like this that have made the honest people pay for his poor moral judgment. Of course, that's why he's a faker.

Unregistered said:

Oh how the Crappy people think the world is against them. Everybody's a thief in Crappys eyes so they violate everyone's privacy with swiping drivers license info for returns to prevent fraud at crappys coast to coast. And the fraud they're talking about? It's nothing more than returning items at the regular price and repurchasing them on sale. Said before, worth saying again. A good practice long encouraged by Retailers in north america to build customer loyalty. Some good retailers recognizing the inconvenience to the customers of bringing back the items encourage bringing back JUST the receipt and refunding the difference!!! Lowest price guarantee is what it's called! Crappys calls it what? FRAUD. Where are the lawsuits, police sting operations on the customers, where are the convictions. The jails must be busting at the seems with moms and dads with all that FRAUD!!! What? There's none? No proof? Then Crappys should have a big frothy mug of STFU.

Crappys, however will violate their own 90 day return policy, and NOT give refunds back to the customer, contravening consumer law. And the main reason for Ellen's consumer article How to get a refund from Canadian Tire - moneyville.ca Blogs

Crappy sucks that bad!

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Yikes, looks like another booze filled tirade. Perhaps this faker advocate can ask his litigator wife what constitute fraud (snicker....there is No litigator wife). Yep, faker all the way....don't forget to donate....the button is really easy to find, and, whoa, they take PayPal in US dollars!

Unregistered said:

Deception isn't fraud? What is it then?
Here, this will help you:
Fraud - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
.

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You gotta be kiddin' me!

You don't know what "deception" is? It means telling someone something that you know isn't true, with the aim of convincing someone that it's the truth .

(Exactly what you are doing here, by claiming that every 'deception' is a criminal act of 'fraud'.)

You see, if I'm sad, but I tell people "I'm fine", that's a deception, but not fraud! Duh!

And Wikipedia is the best source you can quote???

Een Wiki says, "The specific legal definition varies by legal jurisdiction"

You at least did a bit better back in June on this thread: https://www.canadiantiresucks.net/g...nders-post-so-many-lies-here-24.html#post4625

That definition at least included the key parts about "injury to the alleged victim as a result":

If you feel like doing some actual research from reliable (i.e. non-Wiki) sources, you might consider looking into the Criminal Code of Canada. Just an ideas ...

Oh, that reminds me:

Whatever happened to the proof you were going to provide, of your grandiose claims regarding customers who (allegedly) used a receipt from a new item to return an old, unopened item? I.e:

"I've had several people convicted of both fraud and false pretences. If I catch you even once trying to deceive, the police do come and the conviction rate is 100%"

Also, don't forget to post your evidence that someone posting here did something that meets all five separate elements (especially "injury").

Lookin' forward to it!

DavidLeR said:

DavidLeR's Top 10 ...

.... Reasons to NOT exercise your legal right under the Ontario Consumer Protection Act of 2002 to rescind a purchase transaction and demand your money back.

(As described at
"Cancelling a Contract - Ministry of Consumer Services" and at "The University of Western Ontario")

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10 – The CT Owner/Liars have gotten used to a pretty swanky lifestyle. How can they keep that up if people like you demand legally required refunds? Please. Show some consideration.

9 – The CPA only applies to some provinces. The odds are it’s not yours. Why sit on the phone with those liars at the Ministry of Consumer Protection (at 1-877-665-0662)? Or read the poor interpretations of law professors?

8 – Despite the lies the faker-advocates have fed you, all the other major Canadian retailers have the same damn policy, so don’t even bother shopping around. Just do what the CT Owner/Liars tell you to. Who’s a Good Customer??? You Are! Yes you ARE! So loyal!

7 – All that stuff about the CPA? It’s just a myth perpetuated by internet pornographers to profit from e-commerce. Or something. I’ll get back to you on that.

6 – CT Owner/Liars make major personal sacrifices, so you should respect that and support their efforts to get rich. It’s called capitalism, and it’s working. Absolutely, you're just a unionist whiner.

5 – You’ll just come back to Crappy Tire next week and buy some other junk. Why waste a trip trying to get a refund, when you'll just give us the money later?

4 – You’re never going to get rich in your dead-end, 9-to-5 loser job. So why not help the honest, hard-working, family-centric, hockey-loving CT Owner/Liars get rich? It’s just sour grapes to not let them.

3 - That b*tch Ellen Roseman just wants to make money off you. Stop buying The Star and reading moneyville.ca. You’re just making her rich, and that’s what she wants. Make no mistake - the Owner/Liars are the only ones who really look out for you.

2 – Yield to the mega-mega awesomeness of The Red Triangle. Yield, I say!

1 – The teenager at Returns will make a face. It’ll be, like, SO TOTALLY embarrassing. Gaaaawd!

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bump.

Ha. Spending is no doubt down across the board and getting weaker.

Mark Carney | Financial Post

Somebody a while ago said something must be going on for them not to give refunds, or there abouts. It's just a huge facade all built on a house of cards. Once the banks start calling in loans it's all over.

CT Me / Lawguy said:

Illegal is illegal. against a law, is illegal.

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This is now my absolute favourite "CT Me/Lawguy" post, ever!

When buying gifts for friends and family this season, be sure & watch out of the dreaded "Repair Only Warranty" on many items Crappy Tire sells.

It would be a shame to have your gift turn into a deep disappointment, if it turns out to be defective, and the store won't give a refund, or even an exchange.

The recipient could well be stuck taking a "repair only" item out to be fixed, waiting days or even weeks until it's ready.

Why take a chance, that your thoughful gift will turn into a headache, instead of a joy?

Be sure and shop at stores that stand behind what they sell.

But if you think Crappy Tire has the item for a good price, be sure and look into the return policy before you buy.

Just look for the words, "Repair only warranty" on the Crappy Web Site, or check with Customer Service.

That's you cue to buy the item some place else.

Who knows - you could end up finding the same item for less, and with a better return policy, too!